00:00 Hello, this is Melissa Hale-Spencer, the editor of the Altamont Enterprise. And today we have a real treat. We have Victor DiSanto and his Husky Mountie who is sitting quietly by his side being stroked by her, her, it's a her right? Yes, but by her owner and just looking like the most well behaved off. So you might expect the topic today is going to be victor and his dog team and we found out about this and I'll just get the information right up there right away. Um, because in just a few days on Saturday, February 16 Vic is going to be at the old stone Fort Museum with his dog team to talk about the history of sled dogs. He's as a historian as well as a musher. And we're just getting a little preview today. So welcome back. Thank you for having us. I'm so glad you're here. I just like to start a little bit hearing about you and how you got into this. Um, I, I did a little research online and saw, um, video you had made about yourself and I understand you first ran in just sled dogs when you were in the army. Is that right?

01:27 For sure. Sled dogs when I was, when I was in the army, I was stationed out in Colorado and, um, there were sled dogs out there, sled dog races. But that was 20 years before I ever owned my first northern breed type dog. I grew up in a family that had always had bagels for rabbit hunting. But, um, the way I got into it is an 1993, I had a back operation and, um, he was really the worst year of my life. I was on workman's comp and I was used to, you know, bicycling and being active lifting weights. I had been a restaurant or a football player in high school and always worked out afterwards, had been in the army. Um, and you know, I got to a point where I really couldn't even, it would take me hours to get dressed. So while I was in the hospital after my operation of volunteer from the wonder, the humane society's came around and they had a therapy dog and the dog lifted my spirits and she passed out some literature that said that thousands of dogs and cats get euthanized every year by animal shelters because they're really unwanted.

02:47 They can't be re home there really breathing them faster than people can adopt him. So, uh, I decided, you know, once my healed, I was going to adopt my first dog. Um, I was working on my doctoral dissertation at the time, so it took me about a year to wrap. I'll buy it.

03:09 So let's just take a little side trip in here about that. You have a phd in American history, right? And what was the dissertation on?

03:16 It was a labor, here's tree was on a street car, workers of Albany during the progressive era and they're union from 1920 to 1921.

03:26 Interesting. So what are, you mentioned that you couldn't work with his horrible back injury. What kind of work did you or do you do?

03:35 Oh, I was a historic preservation program analyst for the New York State Office of parks, recreation and historic preservation. That sounds like work. Yes. It, before that I worked at the State Museum and visitor services and Interpretation Museum education. Oh, I volunteer there. Now

03:54 I can say you kind of come full circle because you go educating people with your dogs as well. Yes. Okay. Well I got you off the track. So you decided after this terrible back injury that you would adopt a dog and tell us about the dog. You adopt it.

04:08 Okay. Three days after I graduated with my phd in May, 1994 from Suny Binghamton, I, um, walked into the Mohawk Hudson animal shelter and there was a Samuel said, which is also a breed of dog from Siberia. They were all from white. There's sometimes white and biscuit. They have a, a longer coat then malty does, you know. And then a Siberian does frequently. And um, there was a dog there. She had a very nice temperament. Her uh, on her turned during in basically because he didn't keep her in a fenced in area and she kept wandering off, uh, the, you know, premises and he would spend a lot of time tracking her down. So I, uh, I adopted her and her name was snowball. The shelter actually named her. They told me that was her name, but I think they named their, cause she really didn't know her name when I want to first adopt.

05:13 And did you keep the name snowballs? Yeah, I kept it kind of look like a big snowball

05:17 sort of. Yeah. It wasn't my first pick, but it was okay.

05:21 So did you start then with a sledding or was it just a pat

05:27 cause she was, she was a pet. Um, pretty much she was already four years old. I did have an old to bargain and I bought a harness and you know, I had her pull my, uh, my nieces around a little bit. What?

05:44 No. Is that something a dog like that just takes too naturally once you put her in a harness or is it something you have to train her what to do? They're pretty

05:52 much tied to it like ducks to water. Um, generally the hard is as you add dogs is keeping them untangled and getting work as a team and getting to go on the right direction. But the polling comes pretty naturally. About a year after I got snowball, she seemed a little lonely. So I bought an Alaskan malamute pop, which is a little bigger than a Siberian Husky or Sammy. And he was a heavy duty polar. He was a real pulling dog, you know? So. And what was his name? Thunder. Thunder. Yes. That's good. So he was a real polling dog. He had a personality similar to mounties where he was really friendly and outgoing. And if the two dogs get along snowballing tender, they got along. I mean I'm pretty much, they were kind of, they were kept together and they never fought. I think thunder was so overwhelmingly friendly that it was just maybe a little too overwhelming for the first dog at times cause she was more of a one person dog, you know, thunder would just thought everybody was his best friend. So, um, after that, I um, I mentioned that I worked for state parks. I took a job in 1997 as historic site manager at John Brown farms historic site. Yeah. It's in North Alabama. Right outside of like places.

07:28 Describe that for us. That old farm house sitting up on the hill there. It's beautiful. It's a magnificent place. It's um, the former farmstead and uh, home of the abolitionists, the radical abolitionist, John Brown, many people don't realize he was buried in New York. That was his last residence. He, um, came to New York in order to try to start a community of free black farmers before the civil war. Sometimes this community is called Tim Buck two. The site right now it's, it's run by, as I mentioned, New York state. There's a burial ground where John Brown is bird as well as one of his sons, I believe, owned who was shot and uh, he was killed in Kansas during the troubles there, a bleeding Kansas. And there's also a common grave there where the remains of the Harpers I think 90 to Harper's ferry Raiders were reentered in, uh, I think it's toward the end of the 19th century. I think around 1896 they were brought from Harper's ferry, Virginia and re, uh, buried at, at the site there. And there's a high

08:56 jump itself. It's just spare and simple and you get kind of chills walking through it. I think it's a maintained as it was at the time, I'm assuming. Right.

09:09 He wasn't a wealthy man and the form house is actually a little more extravagant then when he was there. I don't know how well you know that site when you first walk in, there's something called the parlor, which is kind of, you know, set up to be this middleclass Victorian Parker Pauler. Actually when John Brown was alive, that's based, was divided into three small rooms. Okay. He had 20 children. So he needed, needed a lot of room and it's not a very large house.

09:50 Wow. So I'm just trying to segue back into your narrative. My guesses. You ran into sledding dogs and like plastic, cause I know they run them on the lake there.

10:00 Yes. There's a mature on the lake who uh, gave rides. His name is John Howden. He runs a candle called a thunder mountain cannon. He lives in a Vermont bill and he would bring his team to a mirror like every day and give her eyes and he gave me my first sled dog ride and from there I bought a sled.

10:28 Wait, tell us about your first sled dog ride. Cause it must have been pivotal if it made you, because millions of people take those sled dogs rawhide on mirror lake in the middle of plastic and they don't go out and buy a sled. What, what happened when you took that ride?

10:40 Amazing. You know, it was um, I think he had about 12 dogs hooked up and just this, the power and the speed and the happiness of the dogs. And, uh, it's something the dogs really like to do. It's funny because a lot of people think it's, it's an you mean or cruel, but it's something to dogs type of dogs. Really loved to do. So it was just an amazing experience. So I fought my first sled and as I had mentioned,

11:09 I'm going to interrupt you again cause I want to just explore that idea. I have a dog that doesn't have a job and I really feel, I mean he was Brad, he's a terrier to do something. And do you just like your philosophy on dogs, those noises you're hearing are mounties is literally mounting herself on the edge of the table, putting your head, which is beautiful over the top. But do you have like a philosophy on that with dogs that are bred to work really liked to work? Yeah. Then

11:40 they need a job to do the keep them out of trouble. You mentioned you have a terrier, uh, the word or actually comes from the Latin [inaudible] which means that her, cause they were bred to dig the earth and go after animals like fact about Fox and badgers. So, you know, generally I think most dogs today are more or less bread to be pets, but they still retain some of the working instinct. And then you could see mount these getting a little hyper, she wants to say something into the market.

12:15 Yeah, she's reaching right. And now she's looking at your ear. Is that like her way of showing her a facet? It's correct. And now she's snuggling into your chest. Oh Gosh, she's cute. Well, okay, so you got your slab and then how do you go about,

12:31 okay.

12:31 Making your sled into something to dogs are going to pull. I mean what happens,

12:37 they had already been pulling a Toboggan a little bit, at least

12:45 thunder was, so there was, there's a cross country ski trail at John Brown farm, which is about, I think it's, it's about two and a half, three miles. So I would walk the trail every morning to look for blow downs and make sure the trails were clear. So are you a skier yourself? Yeah, yeah, I was at that time. Yeah. But I, you know, and then I got into the dog sledding. So I don't see as cross country skiing anymore. So, um, I just would hook up the dogs often. There was so much snow that, you know, I'd have to break trail which snow shoes and they would just pull the sled behind me. Huh. So you were doing the work we have pretty much, well that's what you know today, you often marshes have to, if there's deep snow they have to prepare crown. Yeah. Which snow shoes. So we went,

13:45 you know, dog sledding on that trail every, every morning and after a while they learn the commands and you know, thunder was always a natural. Polar was just the hard part was getting to go where you wanted to go and get him to stop when you want them to go. So how do you do that? Well, it's just working with them, training them about drilling it into her head. It's almost like programming. I could computer he wants it to in there. It's in there. Yeah. But with me it was, it was mainly just going along as we go. You know, the way I trained a lot of my dogs after I came back from Lake placid, I uh, returned to Albany. I owned a townhouse in Albany and I would walk my dogs along this two mile run every morning. So by then I had four dogs.

14:32 I'd have to give him commands. Stop laughing. Go. Right. You had written, this essay is posted online called lightening a birthday present. Yeah. So this, this isn't that era when lightening with one of your dogs. Yeah, he was, he was an abuse case. Yeah. Well this essay is just so moving. If you could of walk us through it. It starts out how you find this dog who, I mean, I can't even list all the problems like leaving ears, worms just fill. Then you were warned by a friend that the two males wouldn't get along. Somebody has to be top dog and you just went ahead and did it anyway. He said, screw it. Jumped in and rescued lightning and they got along famously

15:20 good friends, you know, they never had any problems with each other as, as I got older, you know, as I got tool for dog sledding, some of the younger dogs that came in got on their nerves a little bit, but those tools go pretty well. But um, yeah, lightening was an abuse case. I was at the Mohawk Hudson shelter and uh, he was just, you know, in pretty bad shape. So I took them and rehabilitate her, him and he got along with everybody so I let him stay. And you know, initially I had planned to adopt him out, but he just passed away a few years ago. He lived it. He was, uh, just about 15.

16:04 It's so hard when a dog dies, isn't it? Yeah, it's tough. It's like losing a family member. Well. So tell us about some of the, you've got your name, three different breeds and I just looked up the American Kennel club history of these and I think you could probably make it a lot more colorful, but apparently they're ancient ancient dogs that were really essential for survival in the very, very cold. Um, just could you kind of walk us through some of the history of those dogs? Well, there's tree

16:38 breeds that are recognized by the American Kennel Club, but there's other breeds that are recognized then Canada and Greenland, which are also, you know, pure bred, artic tide northern breeds and there's some which are working toward recognition. Uh, one that I mentioned when we were talking about before was a Labrador Husky as um, the intuit moved from Alaska down to the north than areas in North America. Um, light the Hudson Bay Labrador. They basically travel from west to east and they brought their dogs with them. And over the years each developed different varieties of what was once called the Eskimo dog and the 1880s, the American Kennel club recognize the Eskimo dog as a pure bred dog. These are where the dogs of Canada, Alaska and Greenland, I think the Peery expedition, uh, bought a lot of these dogs to the lower 48. He had a big kettle in Maine and I think that stimulated interest in the, uh, in the breed and eventually at one American Kennel club recognition. Now we really divide these, uh, where you acknowledge that, you know, each regional breed was perhaps a little different and we divide them up into the Canadian Eskimo dog or Canadian ended with dog, the Greenland Husky or Greenland enter the dog, the Labrador Husky, which there's a couple of my Indians up in Labrador working toward getting these breeds recognized by, um, I guess the government of Canada or perhaps a Canadian Kennel club.

18:45 And of course in the United States we have the Alaskan Malamute, which, which is recognized by an American Kennel Club and from Siberia, Siberian Husky, they were for a sport to Alaska on a large scale in 1909 to run the old Alaskan sweepstakes. They were so much smaller than the Malamute type dogs. The Alaskans we're using, what are the Alaskan sweepstakes or it was a 404 mile race from norm to candle and back. It was the longest race in Alaska at the time. As a result of the gold rush, mushers wanted to trace the speed and strength with their dogs against each other. So competition such as weight polls were organized and also a racist. So I'm, the Siberians were brought to Alaska in 1909. They were so much smaller than existing dogs there that they were called Siberian rats. Oh. But you know, they soon proved themselves to have more endurance and more speed then the bigger dogs. So pretty soon a lot of people were running them and they were eventually, you know, winning the race and doing quite well.

19:55 So are the dogs of the Inuit people, the first nation people, are they still an integral part of their life? Are they still used, you know, the way they had been traditionally? Or is it more, um, like

20:09 their pets? And in Greenland there's ports or Greenland where snowmobiles have been outlawed. So the dogs are pretty much used by the green one, the inner width, the same way they were used for thousand years ago. Oh my goodness. And Alaska and Canada, there's still, you know, some traditional Inwood hunters that are using the dogs, the traditional boy. But for the most part, I think snowmobiles and airplanes took over the jobs of the, uh, sled dogs. That's how actually the I did or I was formed. Sled dog teens became such a rarity except for some sprint racing. And I'll ask her that a group of Alaskans led by Joe Redington wants you to form a great fee race to, uh, recognize the part the sled dog had played in the Lisc Alaskan history and that came up with the, I did a rod on 1,150 mile radius from anchorage, which is held every year.

21:17 Yeah, that's spectacular. Well, so you have known racing yourself, is that right? No, I've never raced. I've never really

21:24 had enough dogs to race. Generally in New York state, there's some for dog races, but I really have never had, you know, four young ones at the same time. At one time I did put together, I think two years in a row, I did put together a four, four dog team. I was going to have lightening as the leader. He was a little older than the other ones, but he was still able to sled pretty efficiently. We were going to enter the race, it's called the chapters challenge at Allegheny state park. And uh, there wasn't any snow.

22:07 Well tell us about, I know you're almost like an ambassador, um, for these dogs that you visit a lot of children's groups, schools and like you're going to be doing it, this don't for it. Tell us what, what's that, what that is like? Um, what kind of lessons do you teach the kids?

22:25 I can do it in since 2000 I was looking for some land to move out of Albany because I have four dogs and living in a townhouse was difficult and I was looking at some land at graft and because I liked that area and um, the real estate agency actually taught at the school and every year they studied, I did a ride. A lot of schools in New York state, um, studied there. I did a ride every year, so I was invited to the school and 2000 and that was my first class and later on that year of invited to the winter fest and I'm still at graft and state park and I still visit those. And you know, it's just a good experience. I talk a lot about history, but it also talk about a lot about dogs that have come in to rescue and you know, have had kind of a sad story, but through, you know, the effort of dedicated volunteers, they were able to be rehomed and move on to a better life. So, um, yeah, it's, it's a nice experience. I'd bring the dogs with me on, you know, as you can see, my dogs are pretty friendly in a group of people so people get a kick out of,

23:33 well, it's almost like it's come full circle because it was that dog when you were in the hospital that got you interested and now you're kind of sharing that same, same thing with other people. Yeah. Yeah. Well, it says on the presentation that you're going to be making it the old stone for it, that you're going to go over some of the tools that you use. Like what? What are, you've got a slab, but what are some of the other accoutrements that come with this? How

23:59 are usually show some of the lines that are used to hook the dogs up to the sled? I like to show the people the dog booties, which are like little mittens for dogs.

24:13 Oh. Like I noticed my dog in the cold, his feet. I heard a lot. What do they eat when they're like pulling a sled? They wear these little,

24:24 if you look at racing like the, I did a rod, you'll see dogs have little booties, there's fleece booties and there's other materials to them offered.

24:35 Yeah, I've never had it.

24:38 You're more successful with them. From what I understand, people will use tape to tape them on my, then I usually don't go farther out than nine miles, so my dogs really don't need them. Um, and the idea rod, they used in this scene, the stay on. I've never had too much success keeping on them. They look like little mittens. They have velcro strap, cro strap on that. Just a facets around the dog's wrist. And I also saw a snow shoes. Um, when I first started visiting schools, people as to how do you take the call? Don't forget I started dog sledding and like plastic and where, you know, I would go out when was 20 below. So I bring summer clothing I would wear and like plants that I usually dress up when they're to school children and my big Arctic Parker and my Farhat

25:31 you'd get a kick out of that discussion of temperature. I mean me wonder, and I was looking at the side cause I wondered, you know, a lot of people, in fact our photographer for the newspaper had a Siberian Husky. Um, what they do in the summertime. Um, but what I read on the Akc site was they have two layers of, they have an undercoat and then top coat that reflects the sun so they don't get overly

26:02 now the norm, it's a dual layer coat. So during the summer they're undertow comes out, I called their long underwear and you know, you just have to brush it out and there they're not bad at all. And the day of doubt, even in Alaska, I guess it averages 70 degrees in July and August. So, um, you know, just like with any dog, you got to make sure they have shade and water. They're no worse than any other dog. And then when it gets cold, it doesn't bother them. I've seen dogs that just hate the cold. They won't go out and that could be, you know, 10 20 below and it won't, it won't bother them at all. They'll, they want outside.

26:44 So did you end up with a house in the country? Yeah.

26:48 Yeah. I eventually moved to Middleburg where I live now. I've been there for 15 years.

26:52 Well, I know in the video it starts with your dogs just bursting through this little, almost like trap door, door, door, just belting out like there are so eager to go. D is that door in your house? Do they live in the house with you? There's only a couple now. Hey, well, I mean, so what's that like living with those dogs? I mean that's, that's a lot of dog. I'm my house. It feels fully occupied with one Airedale terrier. I'm just wondering like how, how they,

27:23 oh, I guess I've been doing it for so long. It doesn't really phase me. Yeah. I just, you know, it's, they're not that big of a dog. Really,

27:37 really pretty big. Yeah. Maybe the firm makes them look bigger. I don't know

27:43 the crates inside. And as you noticed, there's the dog door so they can go outside into the council area and there's a 60 foot play area forms. So they keep each other, you know, running around, uh, playing and digging holes. I keeps him busy. Siberians to dig. So I, I don't see it as any, you know, anything.

28:07 Well, I think it is, I, there's this old saying, if you've got one dog, you've got a dog. If you've got two dogs, you've got half a dog. If you've got three dogs, you've got no dog at all because they all kind of entertain each other. It's that sort of, what happens is they have three dogs. You have a team. Well, our time has gone really fast. I don't know if I've missed something important or if you have any closing thoughts that you'd like to share, um, about having dogs like this or any, anything we've missed that's really important to you.

28:40 Breeds can be a lot of fun. It can be very rewarding. I think the problem is people often, you know, they're very striking, beautiful animals and they're generally pretty friendly. I think often people will fall in love with a puppy and they're not really committed to channel this energy that they have into something positive. So I think before you do get a Siberian husky or any breed of dog, try to do your research and try to evaluate if you really have the time that will be needed to, to take care of it, a dog properly. And if you want to get into sliding, there's a lot of people that will help you. Um, there's a lot of clubs out there and it's a lot of fun and the dogs and Jordan doing it.

29:25 Thank you. And thank you Mountie.